00:00 uh that she was the founder of so it was 00:03 uh i was very honored to be asked to uh 00:06 partner with her this year 00:08 and work on this exhibition and this 00:11 iteration of the show um which focuses 00:14 on the lived experiences of motherhood 00:18 but it has also expanded 00:19 into an expanded notion of caregiving 00:22 and the culture of care 00:24 so thinking about reframing um not only 00:28 elevating the labor and 00:31 the corporeal and spiritual experiences 00:34 of motherhood and caregiving but also 00:37 thinking 00:37 uh elevating that uh and seeing the 00:41 art in it um but also making it visible 00:45 a lot of this labor is usually hidden 00:47 it's usually the work 00:48 uh work of women um and 00:51 uh in terms of opening 00:54 the the breadth of the the show up it 00:57 was originally 00:58 you know it's its former iterations uh 01:00 was at the pittsburgh 01:02 um thrivers arts festival and fran 01:05 uh you know designed it as to be 01:08 both a nursing space a space of respite 01:12 a space of care as well as an exhibition 01:15 space 01:16 and i don't think i can overstate how 01:18 radical of an idea that is these spaces 01:20 are usually very segregated 01:23 especially art galleries which are you 01:25 know there's certain 01:26 sets of decorum and behaviors that are 01:28 associated with it and children 01:30 let alone nursing and the idea of 01:33 taking those acts of care and those 01:35 performance of care into that space 01:37 is something that is extremely 01:38 transgressive but i think the key to 01:41 this project is to make it not 01:42 transgressive it shouldn't be radical it 01:44 should be 01:45 something that is important and that is 01:47 valued and 01:49 um and especially given this moment that 01:51 we're having these zoom 01:52 um our zoom gatherings that care 01:56 is essential to and us coming together 01:58 as a community and and 02:00 and having care be centered i think is 02:02 critical 02:03 um in terms of the implications that it 02:06 has for 02:07 our society um so with that said it's 02:10 it's an 02:11 amazing exhibition i'm so excited to be 02:13 part of it i'm a mom myself 02:15 um and uh the artists that were involved 02:19 that are involved uh are just really 02:21 truly amazing 02:22 and so uh with that i'll let the 02:24 lightest collective take over 02:30 okay hi everybody um hi 02:35 i'm olga brindar and if i jessica if you 02:38 don't mind me introducing you this is 02:40 jessica gay no 02:41 moss um also um passively a part of our 02:45 presentation today 02:46 kristen russo is here on the screen with 02:49 us 02:50 go ahead jessica if you wanted to say 02:52 something 02:54 okay all right sorry everything's so 02:57 awkward on zoom you guys 02:58 um so we're gonna jessica do you 03:02 mind screen sharing because i just lost 03:06 everything here we have a little 03:08 presentation a little slide 03:10 to take you through as as we speak i'm 03:12 going to be speaking for the first part 03:14 and then jessica will be speaking in the 03:16 second part 03:17 um we have it fairly organized 03:20 thanks to jessica for actually creating 03:23 a slide presentation i was just going to 03:25 ramble off the cuff for 45 minutes so 03:29 she's here to keep me organized um 03:33 so i started the lioness connect 03:35 collective 03:36 earlier this year it was before the 03:39 entire world 03:39 shut down at the beginning of the year 03:42 my 03:43 daughter was 13 months old 03:47 um and i was thinking a lot about 03:51 what it meant for my identity to have 03:55 changed from that of a creative 03:57 and someone who is kind of on her own in 03:59 the world to 04:01 someone who is now responsible for 04:02 keeping this tiny little person alive 04:05 i was also dealing with a lot of pretty 04:07 serious postpartum depression 04:09 and trying to create and be the type a 04:12 personality that i have been my entire 04:14 life 04:14 um and uh at the time it was actually 04:19 quite fortuitous because jessica was 04:22 jessica you would have been would you 04:24 have had max by that point or were you 04:26 pregnant at the point that i was talking 04:28 about the collective 04:31 i think i can't remember it's all i can 04:34 i know right 04:35 i don't know how time works anymore um 04:38 but 04:38 but i think jessica was either like 04:40 about to have her baby or had just had 04:42 her daughter 04:42 um and kristen um her daughter is four 04:46 months older than mine 04:47 so at the moment lorelei is two 04:50 years and three months i want to say 04:52 because vegas gonna be 04:54 two years in december um and so i 04:58 i realized that i had this this tiny 05:00 little community 05:01 of women that were roughly my age whose 05:04 children were roughly my child's age 05:07 that kind of unexpectedly cropped up 05:10 kristin i know 05:12 i've known for the last couple of years 05:13 through a totally 05:15 different um job description and 05:17 different 05:18 part of my life that no longer exists um 05:21 but fortunately 05:22 i'm lucky enough to have her continue on 05:24 into this part of my life and then 05:25 jessica and i attended carnegie mellon 05:27 together 05:28 and we graduated the same year and we 05:29 both got bfas 05:31 and so i knew her from that context and 05:34 these were 05:34 two people who one who wasn't very 05:37 present in my life at the time 05:39 and one who had who was i knew sort of 05:42 in a passing way 05:43 at the time um who both became very 05:46 fast and close friends for me um 05:49 just through the experience of of 05:51 motherhood and of us all 05:53 kind of dealing with you know our very 05:55 own unique situations but also 05:57 you know collectively socially dealing 06:00 with with the same kind of issues we 06:01 were all 06:02 breastfeeding moms and we're all makers 06:05 we're all 06:06 creatives and um we also have 06:10 two other members of the collective but 06:12 um at the time that we 06:13 set up this uh or were part of this 06:16 sorry not set up but 06:17 we're part of this exhibition it was it 06:18 was kind of just the three of us who 06:20 decided to collaborate and be a part of 06:22 it together 06:23 um uh what was i gonna say okay yes 06:26 so we had uh i set up an an unofficial 06:29 show in january of this year 06:33 and that actually happened right as i 06:36 was getting the idea to put together the 06:38 collective 06:39 but at the time of the show it was very 06:41 much just like let me get all of these 06:42 moms that i know who are creatives who 06:44 have young children of different ages 06:47 and have them show their work so we had 06:49 a show in panza gallery in millvale 06:51 in january of 2020 and creating that 06:54 show 06:55 really got me excited for actually 06:57 putting together this proper collective 06:59 um so at the moment we're still kind of 07:01 small so it's only about five of us 07:03 at the moment but it's all about quality 07:06 um 07:07 we can go on to the next slide jessica 07:09 put this 07:10 uh but this awesome piece we 07:12 collaborated on this in 2009 07:15 um that's jessica and i at the very 07:18 at the end um on the right yeah 07:22 what's your number this night jessica 07:24 yeah and 07:26 so this is this is worth noting olga 07:28 makes incredibly large 07:30 scale drawings so you can see just for 07:32 scale 07:33 that's my body on the right side of the 07:36 image 07:37 and uh my background is a lot of like 07:40 large mural makings but mostly like 07:42 language and type and so 07:44 it was um a collaborative drawing that 07:47 we worked with 07:47 these were five women who graduated in 07:50 our senior class with us 07:52 and we all five worked on this drawing 07:55 at once it was 07:56 it was a lovely experience and i think 07:58 worth noting because it was one of the 08:00 first times that 08:01 olga and i had ever collaborated 08:03 together 08:05 and i'm i'm really excited that you put 08:06 this in actually because 08:08 again i have no memory and even though i 08:11 obviously like remember this having 08:13 happened 08:13 i i didn't even i had like filed it away 08:16 in my mind somewhere that you and i had 08:18 collaborated before 08:19 so when we put together the collective 08:21 and my mom brain took over and you 08:23 brought this slide up i was like yes i 08:25 remember this 08:26 um so so anyhow with this uh it's kind 08:29 of funny like 08:30 bringing up or starting up this 08:32 collective starting anything this year 08:34 the fact that any of us have 08:36 accomplished anything in 2020 08:38 is a feat in and of itself uh because of 08:41 course as soon as i was like 08:42 finally i'm gonna get my head out of the 08:45 darkest places and 08:46 and actually do something um and and be 08:49 in charge of something and facilitate 08:51 and bring people together 08:53 kovid shut the entire world down um and 08:56 so this 08:56 this plan that i had to like bring these 08:58 mothers together 08:59 in this physical space and have us be 09:01 collaborating in person and vibing off 09:03 of each other's physical 09:05 presence and have more shows and reach 09:07 out to 09:08 galleries um sort of kind of took this 09:11 back seat it all disappeared and i it 09:14 was 09:15 um you know and that's that's just real 09:17 life but the fact that um 09:19 despite all of that all of us have been 09:21 kind of in a lot of ways exceedingly 09:23 creative during this year 09:25 perhaps partially out of desperation 09:27 perhaps um 09:28 just partially out of like wanting to 09:30 see the light at the end of the tunnel 09:31 um we still plan on having a an official 09:36 gallery show whenever things start to 09:37 open up again but being able to be part 09:39 of this anthropology of motherhood show 09:42 has been really really wonderful i think 09:43 i speak for for all three of us 09:45 uh when i say that because it's been 09:47 this opportunity to actually 09:49 be creative in this context where we can 09:51 share it in a larger setting 09:53 in a collaborative setting in a setting 09:55 where where other mothers other 09:56 caregivers other people who are 09:58 who are creative and doing this um are 10:01 all 10:02 showing their work and talking openly 10:04 about kind of the struggles of 10:05 what this role means um and that was 10:08 that was kind of a big thing for me 10:10 i think starting this collective because 10:13 and i don't want to ramble on too much 10:14 we'll move forward in a moment but i was 10:16 going to say that 10:17 one of the things that that was 10:19 important to me was this idea of 10:22 mourning my my pre-motherhood self like 10:25 mourning that identity that ability to 10:27 just 10:27 stay up all night and work on a painting 10:29 and not have to worry about 10:31 another human being um and i i 10:34 didn't want to think about it as these 10:36 two competing things 10:38 because for me being a creative is as 10:40 much a part of my identity as being a 10:42 mother 10:42 and so that was what led into me 10:45 creating this uh 10:46 work that i did for this show so can we 10:49 switch to the next 10:50 slide i just want to say a few things 10:53 yeah please go ahead and let our words 10:54 know 10:55 um the far figure on the left is carolyn 10:58 clayton who is also 11:00 a mother now and uh this piece 11:03 in 20 2009 11:07 there's also another collaboration that 11:09 existed in this moment 11:11 someone you might have heard of fran who 11:13 happens to be on this 11:14 call was also working at carnegie mellon 11:18 during this time when olga and i were 11:20 students 11:21 and fran was an incredibly 11:25 helpful and thoughtful 11:28 and supportive figure i think in both of 11:31 our lives 11:32 um working at the print studio but also 11:35 just being a figurehead within the 11:37 university 11:38 and so um to be able to work with 11:42 fran um as a part of the anthropology of 11:45 motherhood exhibition is also just like 11:47 this dope throwback 11:48 that i don't think either one of us 11:50 could have anticipated 11:52 and are really grateful to be included 11:56 in this work with fran and amy so i just 11:58 wanted to mention those two things 12:00 before 12:01 we can absolutely very very important 12:03 things to mention thank you 12:05 thanks for for bringing that up um okay 12:08 so i'm olga brindar that's next slide 12:12 um this is my spooky headshot that i 12:14 took a couple of months ago 12:16 that i'm very proud of uh so i like i 12:19 mentioned before 12:20 um this is very quick but i i received 12:23 my bfa 12:24 at carnegie mellon um at the same time 12:26 as jess 12:27 jessica and um i'm actually a russian 12:30 american artist 12:31 um i was born in saint petersburg and 12:34 i'm actually raising my daughter 12:35 bilingually 12:36 and uh that is also a 12:39 big part of my identity as well and even 12:42 though i don't 12:43 conscientiously explore that in my work 12:44 at this moment in a very 12:46 um direct or very deliberate 12:49 liminal way um it's still very much 12:52 attached to 12:52 who i am and the kind of work that i do 12:55 a lot of my 12:56 work has a lot of mysticism in the 12:59 under layers and that has a lot to do 13:00 with my cultural upbringing 13:02 so next slide and 13:06 so this is a piece that i did for the 13:09 inaugural show 13:10 in january so i called this the holy 13:12 ones 13:13 and um that's why i brought up my 13:15 cultural heritage 13:16 because my roots are orthodox 13:19 christianity and eastern orthodoxy 13:21 and i was raised with a very strong 13:24 culture 13:24 of traditional iconography that was 13:26 something that 13:28 my my father and my grandfather were 13:29 both restoration artists and so they 13:31 restored a lot of religious relics uh 13:33 in conjunction with the other paintings 13:35 and murals and things like that that 13:36 they had worked on 13:38 uh and this painting is about exploring 13:40 so it's my mother 13:42 myself and my daughter when she was less 13:44 than a year old 13:45 uh i don't even remember how old she is 13:47 in this image but 13:48 um just the idea of repurposing 13:52 in my mind and in the collective mind 13:56 the idea that motherhood isn't like you 13:59 know you hear people say all the time 14:00 like oh i'm just a mom like i don't have 14:01 a job 14:03 that's like probably the hardest thing 14:05 i've ever done in my life and i'm 14:07 probably not alone in saying that is 14:09 being a mother 14:10 and i'm only two years in like that 14:12 that's it i have like 14:13 this whole giant road ahead of me and 14:15 it's still been like the most complex 14:18 and complicated and important and 14:19 rewarding thing that i've done 14:21 um that said my making work and being a 14:24 creative 14:25 has has always always been at the 14:27 forefront of shaping my 14:28 identity as well so this piece is is 14:31 thinking about 14:32 uh motherhood as a as a divine thing as 14:36 like this beautiful spiritual calling 14:38 as this thing that not just anybody can 14:40 do 14:41 or um and whether that means you give 14:43 birth to your child or whether you adopt 14:45 your child those things 14:46 being equally valid um just thinking 14:50 about that 14:50 as as women and as mothers like how 14:54 we should be that the role 14:57 the way that we should be viewed is more 14:59 in like this reverent light rather as in 15:02 this this light of you know here we are 15:05 being chauffeurs and cooks and diaper 15:07 changers and floor washers and things 15:09 like that 15:09 uh so that was what this piece was about 15:11 and and i have to apologize for kind of 15:13 stumbling over talking about my own work 15:15 uh when i make 15:16 work if it's still like within a year of 15:18 me making it it's very very hard for me 15:21 to verbalize uh what it's about what my 15:24 thinking was 15:25 it's a very intuitive process and it's 15:27 only like three years later that i can 15:28 write 15:29 or speak about it in a cohesive way so i 15:31 hope that i'm making sense 15:33 i talk about this so um so next slide is 15:36 another piece of work that i did 15:38 um this piece i can very easily say 15:42 now but could not at the time that this 15:44 is very much about 15:45 postpartum depression and about like my 15:47 intense anxiety 15:49 uh and just the my absolute lowest low 15:52 periods as i 15:54 as i was mothering in my first year um 15:57 and jessica and i 15:58 have both kind of spoken about this very 16:00 candidly with each other 16:01 that as much as we love our daughters uh 16:04 it's not a situation of 16:06 like a but b it's a and b it's we love 16:09 our daughters we love being mothers 16:11 and that first year was so 16:14 hard um and and so just like 16:18 just very very difficult and terrifying 16:21 and and 16:22 not fun for so many reasons 16:26 um and and just like being able to talk 16:30 about that 16:30 feels like such a taboo all the time to 16:33 say like wow 16:34 my you know and not in front of our 16:36 children of course but saying something 16:38 like 16:38 my toddler was kind of an today 16:40 is like 16:41 something that people immediately are 16:43 like oh but you're supposed to 16:44 you're supposed to find this rewarding 16:46 and perfect and brilliant and um 16:48 and it wasn't like there were so many 16:50 times that i wanted to throw myself out 16:51 of a window 16:52 or or just had suicidal ideation 16:56 all of those things were happening very 16:57 very actively in my first year 16:59 as as a mother and i love my daughter 17:01 more than myself 17:03 so those two things are not mutually 17:05 exclusive so there's that other 17:07 that next you know that pattern of of 17:09 things running parallel to each other 17:10 even though they are 17:12 in essence kind of contradictory um on 17:14 the surface 17:15 but this uh this piece is is about that 17:17 um and so this is just charcoal and 17:18 paper 17:19 this is actually one of my smaller 17:21 pieces i think it's only about 17:24 two and a half feet tall so it's not 17:26 very big 17:27 uh okay next slide please and so 17:30 the piece that i worked on for uh for 17:33 the anthropology of motherhood hopefully 17:35 you have all seen it but there is there 17:37 is a slide in here of it 17:38 um it's a piece that was a direct 17:40 collaboration 17:42 with my daughter and then it became a 17:44 further 17:45 layer of collaboration with kristin 17:47 russo who 17:48 is our resident poet in the lioness 17:50 collective 17:51 and she writes a lot of work talking or 17:53 she writes a lot of poems talking about 17:56 um all the things that we're talking 17:57 about just intergenerational things 18:00 uh motherhood the difficulty of 18:03 pregnancy 18:04 the exhaustion the beauty the rewarding 18:06 aspects of it the 18:07 unrewarding aspects of it and she has a 18:10 very very 18:11 beautiful gentle intuitive voice um 18:14 i just i'm i've been a fan of her poetry 18:17 from the very beginning and 18:18 actually for our inaugural show in 18:20 january i 18:21 asked her to pair her poetry 18:25 with artists work in the gallery so she 18:28 would walk around and some of the darker 18:30 pieces 18:30 she she paired with her darker poems 18:33 about you know 18:34 depression and and the difficulties of 18:36 pregnancy and 18:37 motherhood and then her lighter poems 18:39 she posted with the more 18:40 joyful and playful artists work um so 18:44 there there has from the beginning been 18:45 this really intuitive 18:47 um collaboration of of of 18:50 text and image um in the collective 18:53 and i hope to continue to do that and 18:57 uh at least like as far as the way that 19:00 kristen and i 19:00 worked in this capacity um we actually 19:03 had her we came up with the idea to have 19:05 her overlay this painting 19:07 over top of my my two paintings that i 19:10 did with my daughter 19:11 um within the gallery so uh but i just 19:14 wanted to quickly talk about 19:16 quickly i'll try to quickly talk about 19:18 um my 19:19 my piece my two paintings this is called 19:21 master copy 19:22 and so uh basically so a master copy if 19:26 jesse or jessica you can go to the next 19:27 slide please um so 19:29 quite simply it's a copy of a drawing or 19:31 a painting um but 19:33 hang on done by an expert artist uh it's 19:36 meant as a study 19:37 it's a way for an artist in training to 19:39 learn better ways of creating a 19:40 composition or a particular stroke or 19:42 any number of things that famous dud 19:43 artists got right before you set out to 19:45 try to make a mark on the world 19:47 so this is the very first paragraph of 19:48 this prose piece that i wrote 19:50 immediately after doing these two 19:53 paintings with my daughter 19:54 so um i didn't want to include the 19:56 entire thing because i don't want to 19:58 read at you for 15 minutes but there are 20:01 some little excerpts 20:02 before i go into the excerpts i just 20:04 kind of want to talk about what the 20:05 process was 20:06 so i had uh two three foot by 20:10 four foot i want to say canvases um or 20:13 thereabouts 20:14 horizontal canvases that i laid on the 20:16 floor of my studio space 20:17 and i brought out some acrylic paint 20:19 that i had just diluted with water a 20:21 little bit to make it easier to work 20:22 with in like a kind of a dipping purpose 20:24 dipping and spreading and brush stroking 20:27 and 20:27 after my daughter woke up from her nap i 20:30 told her i said hey do you want to go 20:32 paint 20:32 and as we came up the stairs to my attic 20:35 studio was 20:36 it's kind of hysterical because she's 20:37 going up the stairs and she's shouting 20:39 orange and then blue 20:41 um and so if we go to the next slide 20:45 um there is so 20:48 she basically started painting um 20:51 after she decided her own colors so she 20:54 told me she looked at me and she said 20:55 orange and so i 20:57 gave her a fanned out uh assortment of 21:00 brushes 21:00 she picked a brush i brought the paint 21:03 over that she had asked for 21:05 and she began to make strokes on the 21:07 page so 21:08 here in this i write in the present 21:10 tense so that there's like this 21:11 immediacy to it for this particular 21:13 piece but it's 21:14 vika places her brush in the bottom 21:15 right quadrant of the canvas 21:17 begins making big bold strokes at once 21:20 carefully considered 21:21 and intuitive i mimic her motions with 21:24 my brush 21:24 my eyes flicking back and forth between 21:26 our canvases 21:27 and envexed when i realized my brush had 21:30 more red paints in it 21:31 making a darker orange red on my canvas 21:33 where her orange is vibrant like the 21:35 petals of a sunflower 21:36 i try not to get up caught up in the 21:38 disappointment and focus instead on her 21:40 pace 21:41 her image emerging so i'm basically 21:44 physically uh mimicking every single 21:47 thing that she's doing 21:48 so she puts her brush down she swirls it 21:51 she turns it she flips it i'm trying to 21:53 do the same exact thing and keeping up 21:55 with her 21:55 and the whole time that she's doing this 21:57 like she has the most 21:59 relaxed yet serious look on her face 22:01 she's so 22:02 confident the entire time um and 22:05 it's it's so uh just funny to me 22:09 that that i'm the nervous and unsure one 22:12 in this situation 22:13 so here when i talk about how my color 22:15 is more red than yellow it's because i i 22:17 mixed red and yellow to make orange for 22:20 her and then i quickly mixed myself 22:22 more and as i'm following i already feel 22:24 like i'm 22:26 getting behind and so i'm already with 22:28 my empirical knowledge with my years and 22:31 years of training with my you know 22:32 malcolm gladwell 10 000 22:34 hours of experience in art making i am 22:37 the nervous 22:38 unsure one i'm trying to be very 22:40 cerebral about it and she just knows 22:41 exactly what she's doing 22:43 so uh if we go to the next slide 22:46 um and somebody just asked me if i took 22:48 video of the painting i did not 22:50 um because my daughter is already a ham 22:52 and every time that i pull out like my 22:53 phone 22:54 she immediately wants to see herself in 22:56 the screen 22:57 so so i didn't want to distract from the 22:59 process so this was my method of 23:01 documenting it was creating this 23:03 uh this prose piece and i was gonna say 23:05 that at the end if people do want to 23:07 read the whole piece i'm very happy to 23:09 send it out um 23:10 but so here's the part here the next uh 23:13 segment 23:14 pardon me uh big round yellow shapes 23:16 begin to fill the corner of your canvas 23:18 and subsequently mine 23:20 baby dog she says creating a small round 23:22 shape with two upward flicks 23:24 the ear is probably she glides to the 23:26 top of the shape makes a larger one 23:28 nearly identical 23:29 pop a dog she returns to the bottom of 23:31 the canvas right at the edge of the 23:33 stretcher bar makes a few small strokes 23:35 quiet again what's that i say as i hurry 23:38 to keep up with her movements 23:39 papa she says her chubby cheeks 23:41 spreading as she smiles wide 23:43 and that i copy her strokes as she 23:45 creates a circle just above papa one 23:48 that extends with a long flourish and 23:50 flicks up at the end 23:51 mama she says matter of fact um and so 23:54 the next 23:56 she begins to draw tighter shapes most 23:58 of them start as looping spirals then 24:00 are gradually filled in with one or two 24:02 fat strokes of the brush 24:03 i struggle to keep up as she gains in 24:05 speed i 24:06 feel the remembered panic and 24:08 frustration of algebra class 24:10 of understanding the first step in the 24:12 equation and then quickly losing the 24:13 plot 24:14 my carefully articulated numbers 24:16 dissolving into uncertain solutions 24:18 and gradually followed by ellipses and 24:20 question marks as i realized i'm falling 24:22 farther behind 24:23 this too i push to the back of my mind 24:25 try to place all of my attention on 24:27 learning the strokes she is doing so 24:29 easily effortlessly 24:31 her face looks placid focused her hand 24:33 holds the brush with no uncertainty 24:36 not a tremble in a single finger did she 24:38 study this ahead of time 24:40 was she painting abstract forms on the 24:42 inside of my womb with her fingertips 24:44 studying sacred geometry while she slept 24:46 how in the hell is she so far ahead 24:48 already 24:49 i feel as though i've been hustled so um 24:52 so yeah i it's it's just like it was 24:55 such a fascinating process to me 24:57 to try to learn from her because i think 24:59 part of the process 25:00 of of doing this was reminding myself 25:04 that just because i have 25:05 you know the experience of years does 25:07 not mean that i can't learn from this 25:10 little unblemished person who is 25:12 just pure and and untainted by 25:16 by these like bad habits and these 25:19 doubts and these anxieties 25:21 whenever i work i feel like i work at 25:23 such a breakneck speed 25:24 because i'm constantly trying to outrun 25:27 the negative critical voices in my head 25:29 that are saying 25:29 well why are you doing this well what's 25:31 the point are you making that stroke 25:33 correctly what does this painting mean 25:35 who's going to care about looking at 25:36 this you're not going to be able to sell 25:38 this it's too big or it's not marketable 25:40 like all of those thoughts 25:42 that that go go through my head about 25:45 halfway through me working on something 25:47 um those things don't exist for her at 25:49 all um 25:50 and so and i loved seeing like how sure 25:52 she was of herself and the only person 25:54 she's ever seen drawing or painting in 25:56 her life is me 25:57 so there's this this back and forth this 25:59 interplay of her 26:00 learning from from watching me 26:04 but not seeing all those terrible things 26:06 that go on in my head about 50 26:08 of the time that i'm working um but this 26:10 part i really liked the process of 26:12 experiencing um 26:14 she says black it is a declaration more 26:16 than a command 26:17 vica is returning to her graphic roots 26:19 her love of my expensive black copic 26:21 pens whose strokes recall chinese 26:23 calligraphy robert motherwell 26:25 the elegant austerity of ink's cursive 26:27 on a white page 26:29 i dutifully squeeze mars black out on a 26:31 ceramic dish and hold out a long skinny 26:33 brush 26:34 she smiles gleefully takes it from me 26:36 begins to write a secret language on the 26:38 white spots on the canvas 26:40 this is not hyperbole it looks like a 26:42 blend of chinese and armenian 26:43 and i'm not sure if i'm imagining things 26:45 or signaling aliens 26:47 or writing terrible swear words as i 26:49 rush to copy her 26:50 again i find myself feeling woefully 26:53 remedial 26:54 i think of every time someone has tried 26:56 to teach me how to salsa or to foxtrot 26:58 usually when i was one drink in which is 27:00 not enough for me to physically loosen 27:02 up and go with the flow but just enough 27:04 to slow my capacity for memorizing 27:06 anything in the short term um so 27:09 and then at the very the funniest part 27:11 is that she asks for red 27:12 last and she says red she says excited i 27:15 nod pressing the last of a drying tube 27:17 of cadmium red onto my palette 27:19 she sticks a dry round brush into it 27:21 makes a single 27:22 well-considered mark just inches away 27:25 from a black mark high on the right side 27:27 then abruptly hands the brush back to me 27:29 take off she pulls at her work apron 27:31 finished 27:32 and that's the process and i and she was 27:35 finished with her painting and i quickly 27:37 hurried up and made the last little red 27:38 stroke that she added 27:40 and at the very end of the piece i do 27:42 write about this um 27:43 i turn to see where she is and she's 27:45 over across the room she's completely 27:47 done with the painting she's not giving 27:48 it a second thought or doubting 27:50 her process or anything like that and i 27:52 look over and she's just standing i have 27:54 this little 27:55 child's easel in my studio just for her 27:57 so she can paint while i'm up here 27:58 working 27:59 um or draw and she's holding two of her 28:02 little toys and she's just like making 28:04 them kiss each other and smiling 28:06 and that's that's the whole process and 28:08 it just brings me back into this moment 28:10 where i realize that she's just 28:13 this little tiny girl she's a little 28:15 toddler um 28:16 and so this whole process for me was 28:19 just 28:20 was just a way to i don't know i don't 28:22 find myself particularly 28:24 egotistical about my work but it was 28:26 also just humbling to remember what it 28:29 what it felt like to to just work and 28:32 not 28:32 think um even while i'm fighting my my 28:35 my little inner mental battles the whole 28:38 time i'm working but um 28:39 but that's this is something where i 28:41 hope like as she grows older and as she 28:42 develops 28:43 i i don't go too much into my didactic 28:46 nature 28:47 of course i'm going to teach her about 28:48 things like color theory and perspective 28:50 when she's old enough 28:52 but i hope that i i still get this 28:55 opportunity to continue to learn from 28:57 her 28:57 and what she's making and what she's 28:59 what she's creating 29:00 um and then the next slide i can't 29:03 remember okay so yeah so this is the 29:04 final work 29:05 um i do want to talk about kristen's 29:08 poem because it's really really gorgeous 29:11 um 29:12 i i almost wonder and i don't want to 29:14 ask too much of kristin the reason that 29:16 kristen is not 29:17 actively a part of this discussion even 29:19 though she's here in the audience 29:21 is uh in the spirit of anthropology of 29:23 motherhood 29:24 in the spirit of what lying as 29:26 collective is kristin came to us a few 29:28 weeks back and said 29:30 listen i am trying not to load my plate 29:32 up too much 29:33 she's at the end of her first trimester 29:35 of her second pregnancy 29:36 and she said in the interest of 29:38 self-care and not overextending myself 29:40 and honoring the process of what my body 29:42 is doing for me 29:43 i can't commit to being a part of this 29:46 presentation and this talk 29:47 um and of course you know in the spirit 29:49 of everything that we're doing 29:50 for each other as the group we didn't 29:53 give it a second thought and we're like 29:54 absolutely 100 29:56 take care of yourself um but 29:59 uh and i so i don't want to put her on 30:01 the spot and ask her to read this poem 30:02 or anything like that but it is a 30:04 really beautiful poem that i would also 30:06 be very happy i'm sure hopefully kristen 30:08 wouldn't mind 30:09 um to send out as well so you guys can 30:11 see but 30:12 it's it's a really really beautiful poem 30:15 about 30:16 like kind of the generations it talks 30:18 about grandmothers and mothers and 30:20 fathers and children and learning 30:22 from each other and the joy of that kind 30:24 of dance 30:25 and so it made a lot of sense for us to 30:28 have it displayed on the wall and it 30:30 actually if you can see in the slide it 30:32 actually goes 30:32 over top of my canvas and kind of wraps 30:34 around it and is 30:36 all over there um so yeah so that's um 30:39 i think that's me i could probably talk 30:41 for another like four hours 30:44 but but i'm not going to do that the 30:47 pieces is yours and which one is vegas 30:51 okay yeah yeah yeah absolutely so this 30:53 bottom piece 30:54 um at vikas height is the bottom piece 30:57 it 30:58 is hers and then the top piece is uh is 31:01 mine as you can see with my more 31:03 red orange and my totally confused black 31:06 marks 31:06 if you actually like look at those two 31:09 paintings you can see which one is done 31:11 with more confidence 31:12 uh it's very very clear there oh and 31:16 kristen says that she would be happy to 31:18 read it 31:19 so um i would love to give her the space 31:22 in the 31:22 in the room right now to to read the 31:24 poem that's on the wall thank you 31:25 kristen i just didn't want to put you on 31:27 the spot 31:29 hi thank you olga i had texted her at 31:32 the very beginning of this saying that 31:34 i wanted to 31:38 yes like olga said i wanted to listen to 31:39 that voice inside of me that was 31:41 telling me to just go within and protect 31:44 and stay out of the spotlight but i 31:46 am a chatty ongoing person too so the 31:48 moment i heard organ start talking i'm 31:49 like i wish i were talking right now too 31:52 and being a part of this conversation 31:54 but olga all that you shared was 31:56 beautiful 31:56 and i want to say publicly that it's 31:58 such an honor to have my work 32:00 shown alongside and on top and in the 32:02 crags of 32:03 your work um you can kind of see from 32:06 this image 32:07 that we've made the decision together to 32:10 have some of the 32:11 words that are overlapping olga's 32:13 painting also be 32:14 on the side so it's like we didn't 32:17 um you you would have to be in the space 32:20 looking 32:21 from the side to catch every single 32:22 letter that we trusted 32:24 people would get the idea so um 32:28 what it said that my poem is called my 32:30 people 32:31 and that is a direct 32:34 kind of hat tip to a friend of my 32:38 families 32:39 um it's so funny to think when your kid 32:42 you think of family friends it's like 32:44 your parents friends who are around a 32:46 lot 32:47 now my husband and i are the parents and 32:50 my kid 32:51 my daughter is around for it so it's a 32:53 friend of ours and 32:54 his name is khalil and he's from morocco 32:56 he lived with us 32:58 for a few years a few months rather and 33:01 it was very it was a really just a quick 33:04 quick rabbit hole it was a really 33:05 beautiful emerging of cultures in our 33:07 home 33:08 and um he told me at the beginning of 33:12 his time here 33:13 that he really felt welcome in our home 33:15 and felt very comfortable here and he 33:17 hoped 33:17 that he could live here until i don't 33:19 know maybe i got pregnant or something 33:20 and 33:21 i was really offended by that because i 33:24 thought it was 33:25 anti-feminist and didn't feel fair and 33:27 then alas 33:28 i got pregnant and that's what made him 33:30 have to leave so 33:32 um i ended up actually kind of finding 33:35 uh joy in the outcome 33:39 and that he sort of uh anticipated that 33:42 and 33:42 finding it to be a a wonderful 33:45 occurrence and a wonderful reason to 33:46 have to kick out your 33:47 housemate so the title my people which 33:50 is what khalil calls 33:52 my family is the title of this poem and 33:55 here are the words 33:58 yes i find comfort in knowing 34:02 in my lineage mamas and papas scrunched 34:05 their noses 34:06 shook their legs after sitting down too 34:08 long roared out happiness 34:11 squeezed my grandmother so tight they 34:12 protested the love 34:15 yes yes the same grandmothers who 34:18 enveloped my mothers 34:19 who folded themselves around myself who 34:22 reach their fingers down as i do 34:24 so you could grab on and perform my 34:27 steps 34:28 your feet floating and dance 34:31 thanks i'll let you take back over olga 34:35 thank you kristen thank you everybody's 34:38 everybody's clapping and just 34:41 i'll just speak for everyone they all 34:42 loved it because it's gorgeous 34:44 i just love this poem so much like i 34:46 said before i'm 34:47 such such a big fan of kristen's uh 34:50 poetry 34:50 as well um just like everything of hers 34:53 that i've read i just find so 34:54 gorgeous and i occasionally say to her 34:57 like i wrote a new poem i want to send 34:58 it to you and then 35:00 and then like a week passes and i'm like 35:01 i don't want to send it to you this is 35:03 intimidating 35:05 um even though she's been nothing but 35:07 beautiful and supportive 35:08 uh so i think before you leave 35:12 can i ask you a question i noticed that 35:14 on some place 35:15 the text also comes onto the floor can 35:18 you talk about that choice 35:20 yeah kristen can you actually speak to 35:22 that 35:23 sure yeah um similar to olga's decision 35:26 to make 35:27 vikas painting the vika height i wanted 35:31 well first to backtrack olga um 35:35 is a beautiful poet herself and she has 35:37 been pushing me to be more 35:39 visual with my work so in our initial 35:43 gallery display that we did as you know 35:46 fellow mothers before the lioness 35:48 collective was officially formed 35:49 my poems i think it was five or six that 35:52 we showed 35:53 and they were framed on oh i got real 35:56 radical like 11 by 14 35:58 paper um and just really simply framed 36:02 and 36:02 it it felt really good and vulnerable to 36:06 have my work out there 36:07 but we thought let's make it as you know 36:10 more artful 36:11 and more of an experience and so 36:14 again some artists jessica being one of 36:17 them may see 36:18 just you know text black text on a white 36:21 wall 36:21 it's not not very radical but this is 36:24 this was a big um big decision for me 36:27 and a big development in uh the 36:30 kind of art and display aspect of my 36:33 poetry 36:33 and so um yeah so the the parts that are 36:37 on the floor 36:38 um mirror the contents 36:42 of the words of the poem talking about 36:45 my steps 36:46 and your feet floating in dance and 36:50 we wanted to invite those who could 36:52 actually make it into the gallery space 36:55 if and when that time comes to walk on 36:58 the words and to 37:00 invite themselves to be a part of this 37:03 poem 37:03 and a part of this collaborative piece 37:07 to really place themselves inside of the 37:09 experience 37:12 thanks jessica no thank you kristen 37:14 thank you for sharing that 37:16 uh olga that was a beautiful 37:17 presentation thank you so much for 37:19 taking the time to share about your 37:21 practice and your process 37:23 um it's really an honor working with you 37:26 and 37:27 kristin and i'm grateful for your 37:30 formation of the lioness collective 37:32 i think it is um 37:35 you know we're going to spend some time 37:37 talking about what radical means 37:39 and as amy mentioned at the beginning of 37:41 the show you know 37:42 um that these these these these um 37:45 choices that we make are considered 37:47 radical but they shouldn't be um and so 37:50 having a group of all mothers to be able 37:52 to come together of 37:53 different disciplines and aside from 37:56 even the art making just kick it 37:58 you know and have time to be in 38:00 conversation with each other eat with 38:01 each other something really beautiful 38:03 so i'm grateful for your work in 38:05 establishing this collective 38:08 um i'm jessica 38:12 uh i as olga mentioned graduated from 38:15 carnegie mellon 38:16 with the bfa my focus was painting 38:19 drawing and printmaking 38:22 which is how fran and i got so close i 38:24 spent more time 38:26 in the print media studio than probably 38:28 anywhere else on campus 38:30 and um i think one of the things that's 38:34 so great about carnegie mellon is the 38:35 resources that were offered for students 38:38 and one of them for me was really the 38:41 print center in fran 38:42 specifically so friend i just want to 38:45 continue to uplift you and your work 38:47 and the influence that you've had on me 38:49 as an artist since i don't know what is 38:50 it like 38:51 10 years now that's crazy um 38:55 after i left cmu i went to the school 38:59 of the school they are institute of 39:01 chicago and i got a masters in arts 39:03 administration policy 39:04 and management there um and then most 39:07 recently i just 39:08 graduated from the university of 39:10 pittsburgh from the school of law in 39:12 2018. 39:14 um this this past year 39:17 i'm really excited um lauren beecham is 39:20 here 39:21 and she's actually a member of 39:24 civil shrine civil shrine is a project 39:27 that was started 39:28 by alicia wormsley alicia is a force 39:32 in pittsburgh and in the world 39:36 she's a multi-interdisciplinary artist 39:39 whose practice 39:40 extends well beyond uh dimensions 39:43 and time and space alicia 39:48 and i became connected because when i 39:50 was a student at 39:51 carnegie mellon my mentor ayanna moore 39:56 who is actually cousins with alicia when 39:59 i came back 40:00 to finish law school ayanna was like oh 40:02 do you know alicia she's in pittsburgh 40:04 you should meet each other 40:06 and you know fam be lincoln fam like 40:08 that 40:09 so i i made a meeting with alicia and we 40:12 hit it off and 40:13 we had a coffee and it was real chat and 40:15 you know real chill and casual 40:16 and we just you know um it felt like 40:19 we'd known each other for years 40:21 and we were talking about everything 40:23 from our creative practices to 40:25 like our dream projects and you know we 40:28 ended the coffee meeting just saying 40:30 that we would keep in contact with each 40:32 other about things that were going on 40:34 i think our next meeting was like you 40:36 know months later and 40:38 uh i ended up i showed up for the 40:41 meeting and i was 40:42 eight months pregnant and i don't i 40:44 don't think i told her 40:45 that i was pregnant beforehand so it was 40:48 a surprise to her 40:49 and i remember her saying like i rolled 40:52 up 40:53 you know to the meeting spot and i was 40:56 like waddling because i was so close 40:59 and she was like whoa and i was like 41:01 yeah i know she's like 41:03 i got a project i want to talk to you 41:04 about 41:06 and this was the early formation of what 41:09 is now civil shrine 41:12 i have a background in working in 41:14 residencies 41:16 i have a residency program in charlotte 41:18 north carolina 41:19 that's called the roll-up uh it 41:22 is uh artist housing uh it's a duplex 41:26 with a two-car garage and 41:27 whenever the garage door is rolled up 41:29 it's a symbol for the community to come 41:31 and participate in whatever 41:33 the artist who's who's housed in the 41:35 space is doing 41:37 it could be any type of programming it 41:39 could be engagement in their practice it 41:41 could just be to kick it 41:43 and the roll-up now is in its third year 41:46 we have two residents who are in the 41:48 space right now they're both literary 41:50 artists 41:51 um and as an artist when i was designing 41:55 this residency my goal was 41:58 you know if i had my druthers and i 42:00 could make a dream residency what would 42:02 it be like and it's like well i want to 42:04 be paid right so 42:06 we are offer artists uh 15 to 30 000 42:10 while they're in residency the residency 42:12 is six months so that you can actually 42:14 do a deep dive into your program and 42:16 your focus 42:18 we give them transportation while 42:20 they're there 42:21 they get a food and meal stipend they 42:24 get a supply and material budget 42:26 and my work as the director of the 42:28 program is to make connections 42:30 for the artists while they're in the 42:32 city with existing arts organizations 42:35 and non-profits that align with their 42:37 work 42:38 also with the roll-up there's no ask of 42:41 the artist 42:41 you know you don't have to develop a 42:43 body of work 42:44 you don't have to leave with a plan 42:47 really 42:48 it's more of a sabbatical than anything 42:51 else 42:51 so come in and chill in the space 42:55 there's a huge art collection there's a 42:57 big library there 42:59 um it's really like everything 43:02 that you would want to live in a house 43:05 for six months 43:06 um there for you at your disposal 43:10 and so i had this practice in in 43:12 charlotte that alicia was aware of and 43:14 so 43:15 when we when we uh really linked to talk 43:18 about 43:19 what civil shrine could be uh in the 43:21 early stages of forming this thing 43:23 it made a lot of sense because i had 43:25 this residency building practice 43:29 um and the civil shrine is really 43:32 modeled similarly um to the roll-up in 43:34 charlotte 43:35 but then as olga pointed to earlier you 43:38 know covet happened 43:40 and this dramatically changed the way 43:43 that we were thinking about creating a 43:44 residency space 43:47 for example you know i inviting an 43:49 artist 43:50 from outside of the city to come live in 43:54 somebody else's house is 43:55 always it's like yo but there's a 43:57 pandemic this could be kind of weird you 43:58 know i don't know 44:00 like all of the all of the the liability 44:03 issues the barriers the scary things 44:05 right like all the risks 44:07 so um alicia's brilliant um and her plan 44:10 was to 44:12 think about ways that we could still 44:13 support 44:15 uh artists who are mothers 44:18 um during a coveted time and so 44:22 um you know everybody does this thing 44:24 right like we meet on the computer and 44:26 we talk 44:27 to ourselves in rooms uh and hope that 44:29 other 44:30 people are listening to us and we turn 44:33 to zoom 44:35 and so civil shrine artist residency 44:38 for black mom artists had 44:42 two cohorts of 30 moms 44:45 who would meet every sunday 44:48 at one o'clock and the same as 44:51 i was uh alluding to with olga and the 44:54 lioness collective 44:56 sometimes we have workshops that are 44:58 about uh 44:59 starting a business and making a budget 45:01 other weeks we would have discussions 45:03 about 45:04 how to start your own garden um other 45:06 times we would just talk 45:08 sometimes we would just cry um there was 45:11 numerology lectures 45:12 like this was just the whole gamut and 45:15 moms 45:16 were paid to not only lead workshops 45:18 during the time 45:19 but they were also compensated for just 45:22 being a part of it 45:23 you know um so yeah uh i did 45:27 shout out lauren earlier uh but i just 45:29 want to uplift her 45:30 to you know lauren does amazing work at 45:32 the carnegie library 45:34 and so to be able to be introduced to 45:36 her and her work 45:39 and create a network with other black 45:41 moms 45:42 who are working creatively is just so 45:44 important 45:45 and so i really appreciate uh having the 45:48 opportunity to collaborate 45:49 with alicia wormsley and the office of 45:51 public art 45:53 to be able to to make this pro program 45:55 happen 45:59 so i had max um that's my daughter 46:03 wow that was like not planned but timely 46:08 um hey baby max turned a year in 46:12 november um 46:15 so she just turned a year old and 46:18 um you know i make drawings and i do art 46:22 and i feel like i want my baby to 46:25 if she wants to uh have that as an 46:28 option 46:29 for her too i think i picked up a pencil 46:31 girl i don't know 46:32 but um i offered her pencils 46:35 and materials to to try to articulate 46:39 herself 46:40 in a two-dimensional way and she rejects 46:43 them 46:44 but she loves this thing i don't know 46:47 what it is but 46:48 she loves this babies like this thing 46:50 right you guys 46:51 babies probably like this so i started 46:55 um when i would change her on the 46:56 changing pad just hold my phone 46:59 uh above her and let the um 47:03 you know there's that markup function 47:05 and i let the markup function 47:07 just remain on the screen and i would 47:10 make certain choices 47:11 um you know i would choose like the 47:13 background for example 47:15 um where i would uh start with a color 47:18 that she could play with and we made 47:20 like hundreds of these kinds of drawings 47:23 um 47:24 and they're so fun as like uh an archive 47:27 of her age at the time you know this was 47:30 in november 23rd she was like weeks old 47:33 you know 47:33 because she was born on the 8th so um 47:37 this is one of the early ones and i 47:39 think it's just 47:40 such an interesting way to document 47:43 document 47:44 her process i hope to show them later to 47:47 her when she can actually understand 47:49 what it is she was doing um but 47:52 yeah i have hundreds of these digital 47:55 drawings 47:56 um max was making at the time um 48:00 i was thinking a lot about how you know 48:02 this is her work 48:04 maybe it's a collaboration but it's 48:05 really hers and 48:07 uh i was thinking about how it could 48:10 become more of a 48:11 we just taught her about so that's her a 48:13 e i o u 48:14 um i was thinking about how it could 48:16 become 48:17 more of an even even more of a 48:19 collaborative process 48:21 and um yeah as olga said earlier you 48:24 know i was spending a lot of time in 48:26 that chair 48:27 in her room nursing for those uh 48:30 first few months and it was such a 48:34 um i don't know i haven't set still in a 48:38 long time 48:39 you know i just it it forced me to 48:42 really like 48:43 sit and chill she's the star of the show 48:49 so because i found myself sitting there 48:51 for so long 48:53 i i started this like sewing practice 48:56 which is not something that i've ever 48:58 done before i just 48:59 you know i felt like dave was uh got 49:02 holes in his socks 49:03 or something so i would sew them down i 49:06 was nesting 49:07 so i i sewed the curtains in her room so 49:10 i was just 49:11 i don't know i was doing this thing that 49:12 just came really organically 49:14 and um that's when this work came to be 49:19 um this is uh 49:23 how do i call them a soft sculpture that 49:26 i made 49:27 it's three-dimensional based on that 49:29 drawing that i just 49:30 showed you that max made and so this is 49:33 the piece 49:34 that was included in our first uh 49:37 pre-linus collective 49:38 exhibition um and i have a little video 49:41 of it because 49:42 um you know i hung it real low so babes 49:45 could play with it 49:46 and a huge part 49:48 [Music] 49:49 a huge part of the practice is making 49:51 this work accessible 49:52 you know and like taking up space um 49:55 taking up spaces like a black woman but 49:57 also as 49:58 an artist and so i thought about how 50:00 this could be larger than life and 50:02 how it could be accessible to little 50:04 people yeah it was like made by a little 50:07 person 50:08 um so i feel like little people should 50:10 be able to to play with it 50:12 i love this video because uh oh i'm 50:15 sorry 50:15 i love this video because the babies 50:19 um in the gallery it was their parents 50:22 who were like can you hold her first it 50:24 was her their parents who were like 50:27 no don't touch it you know like it's art 50:29 like you should respect it 50:30 and this is the moment um for 50:33 kids to let you know like explore um 50:37 and learn and touch and feel and 50:40 you know like be curious and so i really 50:44 wanted to try to find every time i click 50:46 the play i really wanted to try to find 50:49 ways to make it more accessible 50:52 to them you know this this was my 50:55 audience in making 50:57 uh making this piece um 51:00 and so uh yeah 51:03 then i stopped sitting in that chair as 51:05 much because she got older and now she 51:07 runs around everywhere 51:09 and so my sewing practice um my practice 51:12 just in general evolved you know i 51:14 wasn't 51:15 i i found i found myself not being able 51:18 to use my hands 51:20 uh as much as i was before you know like 51:23 having a moment to have a free set of 51:26 hands was just like few and far between 51:28 and so that practice started really to 51:30 change um 51:32 and i'm grateful uh for amy and fran's 51:34 inclusion 51:35 and support in this exhibition because 51:38 uh although my plans for what i chose to 51:42 show 51:42 in in the show changed they still 51:44 supported that shift 51:46 and a lot of this you know you can't i 51:49 can't predict 51:50 that you know like max is my first and 51:52 only child so i didn't know 51:53 that i was gonna be able to use my hands 51:55 for six months you know 51:57 um but that is what 52:00 was reflected in the practice and so i 52:04 i honored that um and i really started 52:08 to 52:08 think then about how um 52:12 there was becoming less and less time 52:15 um for me to rest 52:18 you know that chair that i was talking 52:20 about before that i spent so much time 52:22 sitting in just became like dusty you 52:24 know because i was like up and running 52:26 and doing so many things chasing this 52:27 new little baby with like her newfound 52:29 skills 52:30 um but there was one day in particular 52:33 like i was just sitting down and i 52:34 and i heard myself say something to max 52:37 and it it like hit it was like wow i 52:40 didn't even say that for 52:41 her it was like the ancestors were 52:43 speaking through me 52:44 to her to me you know like i heard 52:47 myself say 52:49 these things like get your balance like 52:52 slow down you know take your time 52:54 it's okay to cry just get back up and i 52:56 was like wow i'm saying this for me 52:58 you know it's like for her for sure 53:02 like slow down you know i know we've all 53:04 said that to our kids before slow down 53:06 but i said and i was like yo i need to 53:08 slow down 53:11 i hate to listen to myself right now 53:13 this is crazy 53:15 and so uh in this exhibition um the 53:18 anthropology for motherhood 53:20 um i made this piece and this is one of 53:23 the 53:23 the chairs that was in her room in her 53:27 nursery and it's my grandmother's sewing 53:29 chair 53:29 which is also um interesting because i 53:32 was doing so much of that sewing 53:33 practice 53:34 uh and i and i set it up in the corner 53:37 of the exhibition because i also think 53:39 too you know like 53:40 when she's too young for us to really 53:42 discipline her i don't know 53:44 you might have you know different shirts 53:45 for different folks but i feel 53:47 like she don't even listen to it if i 53:49 tell her to i'd be like stop she's like 53:52 you know so it's it's hard for me to 53:54 discipline her um 53:56 but anyway i think about how my mom used 53:58 to discipline me and it was always go in 53:59 the corner 54:01 it was like ghost in the corner you know 54:03 and and 54:04 what what a privilege it would be if i 54:06 did something bad and somebody 54:08 let me sit in a corner 54:13 for like an extended period of time and 54:15 just like reflect on my thoughts you 54:17 know 54:18 um and so this uh gallery 54:21 right above the cutoff where it says get 54:23 your balance is a huge 54:24 window it's like really big window and 54:27 so it was 54:28 it was um a decision to set the chair in 54:31 the corner but also like just the way 54:32 that the gallery set up with that big 54:34 window just creates so much opportunity 54:36 for a reflection of meditation 54:38 um and so i'm i'm grateful to show this 54:41 piece as olga said i hope 54:43 um that at some point maybe y'all could 54:45 go there and see it in person 54:47 and and sit in the chair and 54:50 have a moment of reflection to yourself 54:52 and um 54:53 and if not here maybe you just set a 54:55 chair up in your own house 54:56 in in the corner 55:00 so you can take a break olga do you have 55:02 a question for me 55:07 thank you for unmuting me i was like in 55:09 the middle of 55:11 trying to figure that out right now um 55:14 no it i you know i i feel like uh more 55:19 than anything i have a 55:20 comment for you it's just you talking 55:22 about sitting still with your own 55:23 thoughts just 55:24 reminded me of a time that i asked 55:27 kristen to sit for 55:28 a portrait class for me because the 55:29 model fell through at the last minute 55:31 and this was like six months ago you 55:33 know everybody was masked and all that 55:35 and i kept checking in with her because 55:37 i was worried about my models and i was 55:39 like are you 55:40 are you okay are you comfortable and she 55:41 said this is the first time i've been 55:43 able to 55:44 sit alone with my thoughts for 55:47 three hours straight let alone 20 55:50 minutes straight she's like i would do 55:52 this for you anytime 55:53 so i just i i love i love this piece so 55:57 much for that reason 55:58 um how i guess my my 56:01 my big question for you is um 56:05 how has oh shoot i'm sorry i had it 56:08 verbalized in my head and now it's 56:09 falling apart 56:11 how has being 56:15 i know i know just get back up hang on 56:20 how has you becoming um 56:23 a mother allowed you to be 56:27 more forgiving of yourself or has it 56:31 um i think that i was thinking somebody 56:34 asked me this the other day 56:35 and um what 56:39 i i think i am i 56:43 maybe not even mother yeah do you 56:45 consider motherhood when you're pregnant 56:46 too i do 56:47 um i think that becoming a mother 56:51 has taught me to take like a newfound 56:55 respect for my body 56:56 you know i used to like work so hard 56:59 that i would go like 57:00 a full day without eating and be like 57:01 six o'clock oh i haven't eaten all 57:04 day 57:04 you know like wow that's crazy but like 57:08 just be doing stuff and not really 57:09 thinking about or respecting my body 57:11 and when it became not just my body you 57:14 know and it was more about 57:15 um incubating and creating a space to 57:19 birth another human being it's like so 57:21 not about you anymore 57:23 you know it's just like um became such 57:26 a bigger priority and so um 57:29 i didn't skip any meals i think i 57:33 actually gained 52 pounds when i was 57:35 pregnant 57:36 you know like i didn't skip any meals um 57:39 and i drank a lot of water you know i 57:42 did a lot of things that just like 57:44 are duh things you should do but i 57:46 wasn't doing 57:47 um because i didn't have the respect 57:50 for um the beautiful thing that creates 57:53 other human beings you know 57:55 he just wants to be in it that's why 57:56 he's here can you see that i'm doing 57:58 something 58:01 just kidding um okay so 58:04 uh amy and fran 58:08 um that was a perfect segue thank you i 58:11 think have some 58:12 questions for us so i'm going to turn it 58:15 over 58:18 um wow that didn't 58:22 that was incredible you guys um and um 58:25 hey 58:27 um oh i i am 58:31 so proud of both of you right now of 58:34 what you you know since school and 58:38 accomplishing what you've accomplished 58:40 and moving on and 58:42 taking your practice this way i am so 58:45 proud of both of you 58:46 now um i was proud of you then and i'm 58:50 proud of you even more proud of you now 58:51 i'm so happy 58:52 with the way you guys handled your lives 58:55 and 58:56 motherhood and all of this it's just it 58:58 just makes me feel 59:00 good to to see this you know sometimes 59:03 you don't ever hear from students again 59:04 and sometimes you see them and you go oh 59:07 i must have done 59:08 something right but my question right we 59:11 talked 59:11 jessica you talked about this 59:13 collaboration or some um 59:15 that we i guess me by being there we 59:18 collaborated 59:19 on certain things but so my position at 59:23 cmu at that time i had gotten that job 59:27 in 2004. i started in 2004 so when you 59:30 guys start were freshmen i was 59:31 already there but when i um 59:35 when they called me and i got that job 59:39 i um it was i think maybe it was like 59:43 six or eight weeks after i found out i 59:45 was pregnant with 59:46 my third child 59:50 yes so it was a different experience for 59:53 me like going in 59:54 um yeah yeah yeah so lucas was born in 59:57 04 59:58 and i got i started in january 04 60:01 and so my first year um 60:04 at cmu i was pregnant and then in 60:08 november i had lucas 60:09 and so the second year at cmu was all 60:12 about nursing i nursed for 18 months and 60:14 so 60:15 i would go into work and i'd close the 60:18 door and i'd have this big i don't know 60:19 if you guys saw that but i have this big 60:21 poster of um this alien woman with like 60:26 eight boobs nursing and i would 60:29 put that warning up in front of my 60:31 office and say if you wanna 60:32 if you wanna see this then come on in if 60:35 not 60:36 and stay away um and uh 60:39 i'm just wondering and so that's really 60:43 that moment where you know because i was 60:45 a stand-up 60:46 at home mom when i had my two other kids 60:48 so i never 60:49 really had to try to um manage it 60:52 but after having luke as well having a 60:55 job 60:56 it was it was a whole new experience for 61:00 me and i really had to try 61:02 to to manage but one of the things that 61:05 i wanted to 61:06 um exude live the 61:10 sort of that lived experience of working 61:12 in academia right 61:14 i wanted to make sure that people 61:16 understood 61:17 that my priorities of my children 61:21 you know that my families and i carried 61:24 on 61:24 and i always talked about my kids i 61:26 always brought the kids into the office 61:28 you probably didn't see that 61:29 009 by that time lucas was five 61:33 probably not but when they were younger 61:35 you know i would have sean as a toddler 61:37 playing with the computers 61:38 and all that um yes 61:41 and so there there's just a um there's a 61:44 comment that came in that from 61:46 jane mccafferty that says me too but it 61:48 was frowned upon and 61:50 yes it was not quite frowned upon but 61:54 um definitely not 61:57 uh accepted or preferred not 62:00 like they preferred not for you to have 62:02 your kids around 62:04 um but i was um that was one of the 62:06 things that i was adamant about 62:08 about this job is um you know i had i 62:10 had a job i had to build a lab 62:12 and um for me in order for me to do that 62:16 i had to have my children there present 62:18 with me i did not want to sacrifice my 62:21 time with my family for my job 62:23 and so that's kind of where i was going 62:24 so that's sort of the 62:26 uh attitude that i've exuded in um 62:30 at school and i wonder you guys back 62:32 then 62:33 right being freshmen sophomores you know 62:35 and your whole life ahead of you not 62:37 even 62:38 thinking about children did that ever 62:39 cross your mind like oh there's 62:42 fran and she's a mom and she's you know 62:45 doing all these things and 62:47 did that cross your mind at all or 62:50 what was your impression and things like 62:52 that and did that 62:54 affect you in any way at that time 62:59 that's a really good question because i 63:02 forgot about that dynamic like i forgot 63:05 about you pumping and all of that 63:07 which i i think speaks to the fact that 63:09 for me it was like 63:10 oh this is just a thing like i never 63:13 really 63:13 really thought about it too much but 63:15 it's kind of interesting 63:17 it it's something that i think about a 63:19 lot 63:20 like and was thinking about a lot when i 63:22 was breastfeeding the whole idea of like 63:25 why is this a political act but it feels 63:27 that way all the time like i feel like 63:29 any time i breastfed in public 63:31 i was always waiting for a fight 63:34 um which was a weird but in like a 63:36 fierce mama warrior where i was like 63:39 let someone come at me i will i will 63:42 roll them 63:43 out with one with my baby on one arm 63:45 like 63:46 but it was it's so weird to think about 63:48 it in terms of that and like um 63:50 i remember speaking to my my 63:54 father about the fact that breastfeeding 63:56 was something that like 63:58 was sort of a political thing and was i 63:59 was telling him about like the 64:01 the nurse ends i think is what they were 64:04 called like with the 64:05 starbucks and all that and he was like 64:07 are you serious people are weirded out 64:08 by that and my dad's like this 64:10 he's like in his 70s he's like an old 64:12 school kind of conservative 64:13 russian man and he was just like that's 64:15 crazy i can't believe people make a big 64:17 deal out of it 64:18 so it is really really funny and strange 64:21 to think about like 64:22 this culture where we have this this 64:25 huge kind of like cultural 64:27 pushback um of mothers who are now 64:30 saying like 64:31 no fu i gotta feed my kid it doesn't 64:33 matter where or when that is that's a 64:35 priority 64:36 um but it's still very much like an 64:39 issue i mean you are not the first woman 64:42 and unfortunately nor will you be the 64:43 last woman who has told me like 64:45 i had issues with this and i had you 64:48 know 64:49 whether it was direct or implicit i had 64:51 pushed back against this whole 64:53 idea you know and and um yeah i mean i 64:56 didn't 64:57 i like for me it was something where i 64:59 was like oh breastfeeding 65:01 okay whatever no big deal just come back 65:04 later 65:04 um i don't know just jessica do you want 65:06 to answer that 65:08 i think it was such a norm for me 65:11 because i was 65:12 you know my mom was a single mom and so 65:14 i would always go 65:15 to work with my mom i was like 65:16 everywhere with my mom like everywhere 65:19 so i never 65:19 you know that is more normal to me 65:23 than the converse you know like it's 65:26 like why don't we where are y'all's kids 65:27 y'all have kids 65:29 you're not working where are they what 65:31 are they doing who are they with 65:34 where so i mean but i will say um 65:38 it is it is refreshing 65:42 to see that in so many um 65:46 that and things like it you know like um 65:49 there's an artist here i think a couple 65:51 of years ago he did 65:52 the mommy mobile right or like fran you 65:56 you're one of your pieces uh with the 65:58 breastfeeding stations you know like 66:01 um or even the um 66:04 the room at the cmoa that is 66:06 specifically for 66:07 nursing and has the wallpaper that was 66:10 designed 66:11 by the artist that is all of the animals 66:13 all mammals 66:14 also nursing their babies you know like 66:17 again these things 66:18 don't need to be really radical they 66:19 should be totally normalized you know 66:21 but 66:21 um for whatever reason they're so few 66:24 and far between 66:25 so um yeah i've been at restaurants with 66:28 olga 66:29 and she'd just be like 66:33 my fits were everywhere 66:37 like in the same as i would you know 66:39 like having dinner at her house the same 66:41 way 66:41 you know and it's like uh it's not a 66:44 thing 66:45 but we have to continue to not make it 66:48 right 66:48 so and that's that's actually the more 66:51 important piece is it 66:52 well one is why is it a thing shouldn't 66:55 have to be a thing and now that it is a 66:56 thing we should 66:58 try to normalize it which is kind of 67:00 almost you know 67:02 one foot forward two steps back um 67:05 but the the other thing that i wanted to 67:08 ask 67:08 and it's kind of related to 67:10 breastfeeding is that i i see this 67:12 connection between your artwork 67:14 and breastfeeding in sort of that 67:17 ephemeral sort of act like 67:19 you orga olga when you were doing your 67:21 painting with vikka 67:23 so you're doing these things together in 67:25 tandem and somebody asked did you have 67:27 did you video 67:28 it well no because it was that act 67:31 it was that that process that particular 67:34 process where 67:35 the art happened that um 67:39 allowed you to share this tandem sort of 67:41 creativity that produced this beautiful 67:44 work 67:44 and um i see a parallel to that 67:48 and actually most of the moments in 67:51 motherhood 67:53 including nursing where there's this 67:56 beautiful 67:57 sort of performative act of whether it's 68:00 we pick up our child and we 68:02 you know we toss them up to the air and 68:04 they have this delight 68:05 for like split second it's a 68:07 performative act 68:08 the way we talk to our children and yet 68:12 i um we and it's ephemeral and we don't 68:15 get that in a in most 68:17 i think artistic um uh environments 68:20 you know or museums or galleries and 68:22 things like that and in fact 68:24 in academia and amy you can correct me 68:27 about this i i think some of our artists 68:30 had 68:31 um issues during grad school when they 68:34 were making art 68:34 about their children or caregiving 68:39 definitely hold on i have a stampede 68:40 going um all right 68:42 silently run thanks 68:46 this is this is what should be normal 68:48 this is what it is 68:49 this is these are our lives these are 68:51 our our future 68:53 our normal future generation absolutely 68:55 normally i'm down in 68:56 in the dungeon and the dungeon office 68:58 isolated 68:59 and um i moved my computer up here this 69:01 past week just because i've been helping 69:03 with remote schooling and that type of 69:04 thing i just wanted to be more 69:06 involved and uh and i also want the kids 69:09 to 69:09 yeah it's the anthropology and 69:10 motherhood i want them to be part of you 69:12 know 69:13 to enjoy the programming and the story 69:15 time that they i've 69:17 built to them but anyways yeah talking 69:20 getting back to this like um 69:22 general conversation about the 69:24 radicalism or the taboo 69:26 of feeding children and that's all 69:28 related to 69:29 uh the uncomfortability that our society 69:32 has with women's bodies 69:33 and the fact that that um especially i 69:35 think breasts in particular 69:37 um you know there's like these binary 69:40 associations with them 69:41 their sexualized anatomy uh but then 69:44 they're also 69:45 um you know functional right and they 69:47 give life and they nourish 69:49 and that's a big theme with the show is 69:51 this idea of nourishment 69:52 and the and the sort of all the 69:55 dimensions of that whether it's 69:57 food out navigating food allergies or 69:59 coming up with 70:00 formula before there was industrial 70:02 formula when 70:04 a mother was incapacitated in the 70:06 hospital and the father had to 70:08 um you know feed and nourish 70:11 and grow their children and 70:15 and just as i guess an anecdote i i had 70:18 similar 70:18 uh relationship as fran did with 70:22 breastfeeding and kids with my first 70:24 when i was in grad school so i just 70:26 and we lived in like this really 70:27 isolated beach town in the panhandle of 70:29 florida 70:30 so i took the whole year off and i just 70:32 basically just 70:33 yeah breast fed like the whole year in 70:35 isolation and then with my second 70:37 i was newly in charge of an art museum 70:40 and then also 70:41 promoted within that over a bunch of art 70:44 museum a bunch of museums 70:45 and i had like a gazillion signs on the 70:48 door 70:49 like when i would it would be 70:50 breastfeeding or pumping time and i 70:52 remember i would think i was so special 70:54 like in like oh i'm totally multitasking 70:56 i'm calling my educator and we're gonna 70:58 have a conversation while i'm pumping 70:59 and she'd be like i can totally hear 71:01 the pump like i know you're pumping 71:02 right now like i just like oh yeah like 71:05 you know 71:05 i'm just i just have time right now um 71:08 but 71:09 but i also kind of went through that 71:11 phase where especially with 71:12 my first orders it's like this is dumb 71:14 why is that you know why is there so 71:16 much taboo around this 71:17 and you know thinking about the 71:19 empowerment and being proud about 71:21 um you know wearing my badge as a mother 71:24 but then having to experience what it 71:26 was like to navigate the workplace 71:28 um and uh and and also even like with 71:32 carlo i know that there was like some 71:34 policies where like they didn't want you 71:36 bringing your children on campus 71:37 but it was like it's a woman-centric you 71:40 know 71:41 founded by nuns university but it was 71:43 all tied around 71:44 liability so that that was actually a 71:46 bone of contention that faculty really 71:48 kind of pushed back against and again it 71:49 was because of 71:50 like this fear of gonna get you know uh 71:54 sued because a kid gets hurt or 71:55 something like that 71:56 but it kind of goes against the whole 71:57 mission of carlo um 72:00 and uh and i just like completely 72:04 lost my dream oh so anyways 72:08 so uh in terms of some of the other 72:11 artists in the show 72:12 both more than one talked about having 72:15 children during grad school and making 72:17 work about that experience and part of 72:19 that 72:20 part of that was kind of the way that 72:22 olga and kristen and jessica 72:24 explained their art making during this 72:26 time it was 72:27 associated almost like developmentally 72:29 like it was responsive to 72:31 the moment you were as a caregiver as a 72:34 mother 72:35 and the moment that your child is in 72:37 developmentally and how that shifted 72:39 and how your time changed and what 72:40 you're able to create change 72:43 um 72:46 um sorry they're getting injured 72:53 but anyway so the so the other artists 72:55 in the show were making this type of 72:57 work 72:57 and their um professors were very 73:00 dismissive of it 73:01 they said that's fine you can make this 73:02 work for right now but don't expect this 73:05 to be 73:05 a practice like a prolonged practice and 73:08 one of one of the artists even said that 73:11 she was surprised even um with like 73:14 professors that had children 73:15 that would come in and be like i don't 73:17 have any resp like i don't 73:18 i'm not responsive to this work and you 73:21 know 73:22 that i mean the fact that this was not 73:24 just an isolated 73:25 kind of anecdote but something that was 73:27 experienced and i think that speaks a 73:28 lot not only with 73:30 the professional world and how hostile 73:32 it is but specifically 73:34 the art professional world and the 73:36 institutions of art 73:37 and how um restrictive they are 73:40 um so i don't should i throw out a 73:43 question and then i'll mute so that you 73:44 don't have to hear 73:46 well i wanted i wanted to ask that the 73:48 audience look we are at 5 73:50 50 and jessica and olga have a 73:55 performance to do so i just um want to 73:59 uh 74:00 open it i may interrupt um jess and i or 74:03 jessica and i were talking about just 74:05 skipping that because it was just gonna 74:06 be like story time so we can definitely 74:09 spend more time having this conversation 74:11 we were talking about it privately um 74:14 yeah well we'll we'll see um let's see 74:17 if um 74:18 the the time takes us to the end i'm 74:20 wondering if anybody has 74:21 any questions i want to open up to the 74:23 floor uh for 74:25 anyone feel free to just use your mic 74:28 unmute your mic 74:28 or type in the chat if you don't want to 74:31 um uh 74:32 unmute yourselves um do we have any 74:35 questions 74:36 um to amy do you mind friend if i 74:39 respond to 74:39 what amy was saying no not at all please 74:42 amy i think your point 74:44 uh didn't fall on deaf ears about the 74:47 art 74:47 world not respecting moms who function 74:50 as 74:51 artists um and i think you know 74:55 the ecosystem of art has 74:58 many facets you know um and one of them 75:01 to support artists is residency programs 75:04 which we know 75:05 right create opportunities for learning 75:08 and development and that's really alicia 75:10 speaks so eloquently 75:12 and tells this narrative about how she 75:14 was planning on going to a residency 75:18 she had these babies lined up like her 75:20 whole calendar 75:21 and then as soon as she let them know 75:23 that she was pregnant they're like oh we 75:24 assume you're not coming 75:26 you know it's just the assumption that 75:28 um 75:29 and it's not even about a lack of space 75:31 you know because you know you usually 75:33 get your whole 75:34 you know you get your whole setup right 75:36 it's just like an excuse 75:37 and there's never really a reason why um 75:41 they they use this line of liability 75:43 right but i'm gonna be there 75:44 i could fall down the stairs you know 75:46 like 75:48 it's just it's make-believe and so i 75:50 think a lot of 75:52 the onus um falls on us 75:55 to try to create our own systems uh that 75:59 support us and care for us in the ways 76:01 that we're not being supported and cared 76:03 for within the greater 76:05 arts ecosystem and so i just i 76:08 i heard your point and i just wanted to 76:10 make sure 76:12 to touch on that before we wrapped up i 76:15 think that guys make me so proud 76:20 i can respond to jessica's response 76:24 just very quickly um i i was thinking 76:28 about 76:28 as as amy was talking about 76:32 her very valid strong point about the 76:34 art world being hostile to mothers 76:36 um how very recently it is 76:39 that we as women have been allowed to be 76:43 in that world and definitely 76:47 uh you know women of color as well would 76:49 be even even later than that like in 76:51 in the mainstream for us to be accepted 76:54 it's like it's such a 76:55 short it's such a short time span in the 76:58 history of like you know 76:59 western museum style art so 77:03 so in a lot of ways we're very much you 77:05 know not to put too fine a point on it 77:07 in the infancy 77:08 of of fighting for all of these things 77:11 and fighting for that inclusion and that 77:12 equal footing 77:14 well i want to also like parse apart a 77:16 couple of these 77:18 um you know suppressions which is 77:21 that not only are women and 77:24 caregivers like structurally not able 77:27 you know it's structurally hostile in 77:29 terms of 77:30 figuring out you know when you know 77:32 caregiving for your children and and 77:34 that type of thing but then in terms of 77:35 content that's being represented in the 77:37 art itself 77:39 um is also um oppressed basically and 77:42 and kept out so it's this it's it's in 77:45 it's really 77:46 mind-boggling if you think about it like 77:48 how comprehensive 77:50 that suppression is so um 77:53 i want to read something i don't know if 77:56 you have 77:56 if any um anyone here has visited the 77:59 website the anthropology of a 78:01 motherhood website anthropology of 78:03 motherhood.com 78:04 and our flyer where amy and i write this 78:07 statement 78:07 about um why this show is and why it's 78:11 so 78:12 radical and important at this point and 78:14 one of the lines 78:16 in the um let me find it 78:19 lord okay so when i first wrote this 78:22 essay i quoted anne marie slaughter 78:24 she's the president of a new america 78:25 foundation 78:26 and she says that 78:30 um human beings cannot survive alone i 78:33 mean this is very 78:35 you know ubiquitous anthropological 78:37 stuff here 78:38 therefore we must care for one another 78:40 slaughter 78:41 calls for us to refocus our pursuit of 78:44 happiness from competition 78:46 and financial success to a social 78:49 infrastructure that gives equal 78:51 importance to 78:52 competition and caregiving so i want to 78:54 point that out we're talking about all 78:56 of these sort of hostility towards women 78:59 and the concept of caregiving and um 79:02 uh you know and letting us into these 79:07 big businesses whatever it is the art 79:09 business the gallery business the 79:11 academic business and things like that 79:13 in general you know we are in a very 79:16 competitive environment 79:18 um within and outside of the art 79:22 ecosystem 79:23 and i think that's a general attitude 79:27 that most of us um most businesses 79:31 really let's be specific and um 79:34 and government uh focus on 79:37 is that competition of being you know 79:40 being 79:41 so much better so much richer acquiring 79:44 more things 79:44 and this is the value system that we've 79:46 we've grown up to have and that with 79:48 that the united states has evolved in 79:50 so really anthropology of mother is a 79:53 call out to sort of 79:54 recognize that recognize that 79:57 this is where we are and calling a shift 80:01 to that 80:02 let's shift our focus and just 80:04 instead of competing 80:06 with each other and trying to be more 80:08 financially sound than each other let's 80:11 take care of each other let's look out 80:13 for each other and so 80:15 the the way that you guys are explaining 80:17 all of these 80:18 really all of these points comes down to 80:22 why is it that people don't see 80:25 the world the way mothers can 80:28 the mothers would see their world in the 80:30 microcosm of the way mothers take care 80:32 of their families we 80:33 it's that is not the macro and then we 80:37 it is very obvious right now during the 80:38 pandemic 80:40 that a lot of these caregiving skills 80:42 these caregiving 80:43 attitudes this system is not working 80:48 so i just wanted to throw that out there 80:51 yeah fran we got to start caring for 80:53 each other 80:54 yeah sure for sure well and i 80:57 uh want to point out too is we had uh 81:00 melissa shaganov 81:02 uh who is uh an indigenous artist 81:05 um an activist from alaska come and do a 81:08 workshop on land acknowledgement 81:10 and a big part of this like that as um 81:14 i've worked on this with fran and have 81:16 worked on other kind of research 81:17 projects parallel 81:18 to it that looks at it in terms of like 81:21 the culture of care as something that's 81:23 antithetical to 81:24 western capitalist eurocentric values 81:28 and the way society is um structured 81:31 that you know melissa really talked 81:33 about indigenous culture 81:35 um and talked about ideas of like the 81:38 visiting culture 81:39 in in her community that that to take 81:42 time 81:42 and visit with elders at their houses 81:45 and spend time and slow that time down 81:48 um i think it's fundamentally like a 81:51 cultural difference and i think that 81:53 um you know this tension between the 81:55 micro and the macro 81:57 is a result of the the residues 82:00 of of colonialism uh the way in which 82:04 capitalism 82:05 is structured purely you know it's based 82:07 on competition 82:08 it's based on like zero sum you know uh 82:11 acquisition of resources so the other 82:12 thing that melissa talked about was gift 82:14 giving culture 82:15 that you circulate the gifts and it 82:16 creates a network of 82:18 relationships it's relational and that's 82:20 how you build strength 82:22 politically and socially and culturally 82:24 in her culture with the tribes 82:26 we don't have that we have acquisition 82:28 culture right we don't 82:29 circulate the gifts we we act quiet so i 82:32 think these are all 82:33 like and that's what i love about the 82:35 show and the idea that 82:36 what fran brought to me is this idea of 82:39 just expanding 82:41 using motherhood as a very accessible 82:46 jumping off point to expand into these 82:49 much larger questions um 82:52 regarding this and i i um just wanted to 82:55 say just some remarks on on after 82:57 listening to olga and chris and jessica 82:59 talk but there's 83:00 um you know there's such an emphasis i 83:02 think in storytelling 83:04 uh there's an emphasis that i think 83:06 amongst all of your work in terms of 83:07 mark making 83:09 um that i think is really interesting um 83:12 i i wanted you know i really jessica 83:15 really enjoyed 83:16 your the example of the digital drawings 83:19 that you did with your daughter 83:20 i think um just in terms of like mom 83:23 mommy culture if you will 83:25 and uh the the um 83:28 contested space of the screen and screen 83:31 time 83:32 um how you because it's true like like 83:34 those phones are designed to like tap 83:37 into 83:37 our like you know intuitive you know 83:41 whatever subconscious nervous system and 83:43 it's just like 83:44 physically addictive for us so it's 83:45 obviously going to be physically 83:47 addictive 83:48 for children but how you you know 83:51 turned that around pivoted that into 83:53 this creative space and into utilizing 83:55 it as a tool 83:57 again for mark making and looking 83:59 documenting process 84:01 i thought was really interesting um and 84:03 and also 84:04 the the way in which that you translated 84:06 that into space and then 84:08 um with the with the soft sculpture and 84:10 thinking about accessibility and 84:12 thinking 84:12 taking space that was really interesting 84:15 but um 84:16 again i i just think it's you know i 84:18 really 84:19 enjoyed your presentations i love your 84:21 works and your work in the gallery 84:23 um and hopefully in january we'll be 84:25 able to bring the artists and our 84:27 families into the space 84:28 um and limited visitors but right now um 84:32 the current conditions were not so we're 84:34 gonna try our best to 84:35 um you know create at least some more 84:37 virtual experiences 84:39 um but this idea of like tandem 84:41 creativity 84:42 um and and this the the shifting of time 84:46 and the sense of time i think that's 84:47 another theme in the show um there's a 84:49 video called obsession 84:50 um and the artist the way it's about 84:53 breastfeeding it's about like the the 84:55 early years 84:56 of the artist's daughter but the way in 84:59 which the editing 85:00 uh speeds up and slows down in terms of 85:03 the montage 85:04 and slows down at the point where she's 85:05 like zooms in for 85:07 uh like the mo the act of breastfeeding 85:10 and the intimacy of it i think it really 85:12 reflects the way in which time is so 85:14 malleable and flexible and how 85:16 absolutely fast it is but how much it 85:18 slows down and that's i think reflected 85:20 um again jessica and how you adapted the 85:23 work 85:23 and also what um kristen uh and 85:26 olga were saying and the idea too of 85:28 this like intergenerationality 85:30 aspect i think that kind of permeates 85:32 the whole thing 85:33 uh your whole project so i just wanted 85:35 to like throw out those comments 85:36 um based on you know i'm i'm the 85:39 privileged one that gets to go into the 85:41 space 85:41 all the time like this is a great show 85:44 too bad nobody can actually join me in 85:45 here 85:46 um but um but anyway so it was really 85:49 great to hear your commentary on it i 85:51 just wanted to kind of throw out those 85:52 reflections 85:54 i want to open the floor it's already 85:56 six o'clock ladies 85:58 um people so sorry if we kind of took 86:02 over the air time but 86:03 if are there any um participants here 86:06 who would like to ask a question now for 86:08 the artist or for me and amy or to each 86:10 other 86:11 please feel free to unmute yourselves 86:13 and we'll give ourselves another five 86:14 minutes 86:16 to do that 86:23 um i just want to acknowledge 86:26 um oh sarika are you coming yeah i had a 86:30 i actually wanted to make a comment and 86:32 i'm like so 86:33 impressed with how olga and jessica were 86:35 talking about motherhood 86:37 for me the experience was very different 86:39 after i graduated from cmu i was 86:42 pregnant in 2007 86:45 and i had a show at the mattress factory 86:47 museum and i remember leaving my 86:49 daughter at home 86:50 and installing there for the whole day i 86:53 left the house at nine 86:55 told my mom i'll be back in two hours 86:57 did not come back till 86:59 10 at night and i was covered in red 87:01 chili pepper when i came back and my 87:03 mother 87:04 like you left the kid like 87:07 she was being like i had pumped enough 87:10 for her to be fed 87:11 but i just like was on a different zone 87:14 so i could kind of relate to you talking 87:16 about like how it's a bittersweet 87:19 experience because when you're working 87:20 hard for your 87:22 projects or staying up night you make 87:24 that choice but when you have a baby 87:26 it's not a choice you have to stay up 87:28 and feed the child because you have to 87:30 do it nobody else can 87:32 um but i i really thought like 87:35 it's incredible how you can kind of have 87:38 like 87:39 made your kids a part of your work it's 87:41 been very difficult for me because i'm 87:43 too much of a control freak 87:45 but it's good to hear 87:50 thank you thank you for that 87:58 so i'm just curious are there any uh 88:01 non-mothers or non-parents 88:03 in the uh in the audience and what they 88:06 think about this 88:07 yeah i know i've got a lot of mice oh 88:09 sarah and that 88:11 handful of my students are in this class 88:13 students 88:14 if you want to ask a question 88:23 so um i'm one of the students my name is 88:26 rayna 88:26 and i am only 21 88:30 and i don't have any kids i'm still in 88:33 school and 88:35 it's just really inspirational to see 88:38 women and how powerful they are and how 88:41 they can take this time 88:42 and like they form a human being 88:46 in their body and then not only that 88:48 everything changes 88:50 your hormones change your life changes 88:52 completely 88:53 but to still be able to go and like 88:56 incorporate it 88:57 into like kind of intertwining like 89:00 their new life and their old life to 89:01 create a 89:02 beautiful balance is so impressive and 89:05 it's not only impressive because like i 89:06 love 89:07 seeing all these powerful women but it's 89:09 a good reminder because like 89:10 everything's really stressful and just 89:12 like life is hard 89:13 and so things are changing and even 89:16 though 89:17 you might be like from not having kid to 89:19 having a kid is so different 89:20 you can still find a new middle ground 89:23 so you can 89:24 keep your identity as a theme like 89:27 as an individual and kind of preserve it 89:31 because i think a lot of times moms are 89:33 so willing and so giving 89:35 that they become the identity of only a 89:38 mother 89:39 and that that's great i mean it's not a 89:40 bad thing but it's hard for them 89:42 and it's kind of optimistic for me 89:45 because it's like okay 89:46 you don't have to worry about 89:47 sacrificing totally you can include your 89:50 kids into what you do 89:52 and you can make those adjustments as 89:54 like um 89:55 the one person mentioned before it's 89:57 like you know if you're type a 89:58 you can still make the accommodations 90:01 even though it seemed impossible before 90:03 you had the kid 90:04 that it kind of like i don't know 90:05 empowered you and you strengthened and 90:07 you were able to do this and 90:08 i don't know it just overall makes me 90:11 feel empowered as a female but also 90:12 as an individual who is more type a 90:16 thank you for that and i just i just 90:18 wanted to quickly respond to you 90:21 and uh at least for me 90:24 because i am a very type a person i just 90:27 want to 90:28 my therapist is speaking through me 90:30 right now i want to dispel the myth that 90:31 there is any sort of balance 90:33 because there isn't um some days i'm an 90:37 incredible artist and other days i'm an 90:39 incredible mom 90:40 and i'm not both at the same exact time 90:42 um and it's 90:43 my practice at least for me i don't want 90:45 to speak to anyone else's experience or 90:47 jessica's experience or anything like 90:48 that but 90:49 at least for me it is a constant uh 90:53 struggle to try to maintain those two 90:55 things and it's a learning process and 90:57 it gets 90:57 easier as vika gets older um 91:01 but it is still like very hard like what 91:03 jessica was saying before about like 91:05 kind of 91:06 neglecting your own body and not eating 91:08 um every 91:10 you know if i'm having a very productive 91:11 day uh every like three hours or so 91:14 i i'm like oh did i feed my kid 91:17 like stuff i checked her diaper like 91:19 she's running around 91:20 she's playing and she's not screaming 91:22 but it is um it's definitely 91:24 uh it is it is this this contention all 91:28 the time with that 91:29 and and the mom guilt is very real and 91:32 uh just want to throw out there real 91:34 quick a psa for 91:36 everyone should be in therapy because 91:38 it's extremely important 91:40 to have a professional remind you every 91:42 week that you're not up 91:44 um as much as you think you are um that 91:46 said 91:47 i'm i find your comments very valuable 91:50 and very important 91:51 because it is it is important as jessica 91:54 was saying and as fran was saying for us 91:55 to take care of each other and support 91:57 each other whether we're 91:58 moms or not or whether we're planning to 92:01 be moms eventually 92:03 on that note um thank you olga 92:06 i just want to say thank you to jessica 92:07 and olga and to sarah of course our 92:10 digital content curator 92:12 amy um on b for being here and putting 92:16 this together 92:16 thank you jessica and olga this was a 92:18 wonderful talk 92:19 and we know you have to go you guys have 92:22 busy lives 92:23 so um i just want to remind everyone 92:26 that this um 92:27 this session was recorded i will be 92:29 sending the recording out to the people 92:31 who participated in the session so we 92:33 can review it 92:34 and um um you know go back for any 92:37 information that you need again 92:39 the website for the show is 92:43 www.anthropologyofmotherhood.com 92:45 please visit it and look at the 92:47 wonderful work that jessica olga and 92:49 kristen have there 92:51 thank you kristen for being with us 92:53 thank you fran 92:54 thank you amy i know i can speak on 92:56 behalf of the entire lioness collective 92:59 where we are just so humbled and honored 93:02 to be able to be in community with you 93:03 all today thank you for creating this 93:05 space for us fran thank you for the 93:07 legacy that you're building for mothers 93:09 in our city and beyond 93:11 we are honored blessings thank you all 93:21 oh and fran before you go um there were 93:24 some folks who were interested in 93:25 reading the whole 93:26 master copy may i mail that to you so 93:29 you can send it around for those who are 93:31 interested and also 93:32 um kristin's poem kristen uh i don't 93:35 know if she's still on here if she's not 93:36 i'll just grab her 93:37 but i can i forward both of those things 93:39 to you for those people 93:40 this is that okay thank you absolutely 93:43 all right thank you so much thank you 93:45 thank good job all guy you did yeah 93:47 excellent job thank you so much olga 93:49 jessica and kristen you're so proud 93:52 [Laughter] 93:58 thank you thanks everyone